User talk:Meneth/2015

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Archive of all User talk:Meneth discussions from 2015. If you want to restart one of these discussions, copy it to User talk:Meneth and add your comments. This page cannot be edited.


How can I export localisation? I tried it but no success.

I'm not sure what you mean, sorry. BTW, sign talk page comments with four tildes (~~~~). ~ Meneth (talk) 17:33, 26 February 2015 (CET)

Question on achievements article for 1.10

Hi Meneth,

Firstly, thanks for putting up with me, and secondly, thanks for correcting my errors. I've got just one quick question – the achievements for 1.10 have not yet been classified for difficulty in achievements.txt; how should they be added to the achievements page, then? Mapleyy (talk) 19:04, 26 February 2015 (CET)

Wiki users can classify them. If you're unsure what category an achievement fits in, just stick it in "unrated" or something like that. ~ Meneth (talk) 19:09, 26 February 2015 (CET)
Got it, thanks. Mapleyy (talk) 19:19, 26 February 2015 (CET)

Sub-saharan Nations

On the Sub-Saharan nations page, a few of the ones mentioned under notable are relinked to the Sub-saharan countries page and aren't mentioned in the table beneath. So basically they don't have any descriptions. Now it's impossible to create the page, because it already exists, but simply redirects to the Sub-Saharan countries page. I'd be willing to create a the pages for them.

Sign talk-page comments with four tildes (~~~~).
When you get redirected, the top of the page will have a link to the redirect page. Go there, and you'll be able to edit the page. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:53, 27 February 2015 (CET)

Missions and is_playing_historical_setup "allow" in 1.10

One of the new "allow" conditions in 1.10 is "is_playing_historical_setup", which, of course, checks if the player is playing a historical setup before the mission can be displayed; should this be included in the mission information? Mapleyy (talk) 02:59, 28 February 2015 (CET)

Not sure that's really necessary since it is generally pretty common sense whether a mission will be available or not when the world is randomized. ~ Meneth (talk) 13:59, 28 February 2015 (CET)

Contest Ticket Issue

Hello. I was supposed to recieve 2 tickets for writing a strategy guide on Westphalia, but I only received 1 ticket. --Curbon7 (talk) 00:24, 1 March 2015 (CET)

Westphalia was not on the list of countries that need a strategy guide, due to not existing in 1444. Additionally, the guide wasn't especially detailed. 1 ticket therefore seemed appropriate. ~ Meneth (talk) 00:32, 1 March 2015 (CET)

Some achievement guides/edits.


I added 'Je maintiendrai' and 'Blockader' achievement guides (and update the achievements page to link to it). It might be best to ignore the many edits that I required to bring the new pages up to something more in line with the style guide than the first attempt and just consider the end result.

Also updated 'Turn the Table' achievement with alternative guide.

Kind Regards, Rygel8472

I'll look through it soon. ~ Meneth (talk) 19:23, 1 March 2015 (CET)

Questions about the competition

Hi, was wondering something after looking at people's submissions: Do we need to verify the information, or just compare it to 1.10's patch notes or something? ie. should we assume the values haven't changed through the patches if it isn't explicitly stated? --TheWinner (talk) 15:41, 3 March 2015 (CET)

The information should be verified in some way. Mapleyy uses GitHub to see which files have changed, for example. "Stealth" changes are pretty common. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:43, 3 March 2015 (CET)
Hi, I suppose you're referring to what I've been doing? I've been comparing game files with old ones (git repo), and one's I've verified the changes, I'll sprint through the article sections (for example, in Religions and denominations, Government, Land units, etc.). In the case of articles such as Navy and Manpower, the bonus table template has already been updated for 1.10, so the only thing that needs to be done is that the other stuff (body text/info/stats) is verified in-game, and I'll sprint through the sections in that case too. In the case of country articles, the national idea tables have been verified, so the only thing that really needs to be checked are the other properties such as religion and capital location/name/province ID, and to check that the strategy guide can plausibly work for 1.10 (and that the mechanics discussed still behave the same.) Mapleyy (talk) 15:49, 3 March 2015 (CET)
Oh, quicker than what I've been doing it seems. Just wanted to get you disqualified and win make sure the wiki wasn't being badly verified. Thanks anyways --TheWinner (talk) 16:00, 3 March 2015 (CET)
I do do occasional common sense checks, you know ;). Though Mapleyy could certainly be a bit better about writing a justification when he verifies something, though so could you. ~ Meneth (talk) 16:07, 3 March 2015 (CET)
Well, honestly, I'm trying to win and to do that I'm trying to minimize the effort/time and maximize the results. I was going back and forth a lot at first; it's a lot easier to do things in "bulk". Mapleyy (talk) 16:09, 3 March 2015 (CET)
What's certain is that one of you two will win. With so few outdated pages, I don't see how anyone could beat both of you at this point. Plus the odds are very high that both of you will win something in the raffle.
I might calculate those odds if I get bored. ~ Meneth (talk) 16:13, 3 March 2015 (CET)

Added new page

Added a guide for the King of Jerusalem achievement. Linked it from the achiev page.

- Snickersnak

You don't need to tell me; I get email alerts. I'll process your contributions later.
Sign talk-page messages with four tildes (~~~~). ~ Meneth (talk) 15:55, 3 March 2015 (CET)

Total war


Just wondering, have you noticed the deletion tag on Total war? It was apparently added there in December, not sure if you've seen it, as nothing seems to have changed since then. Mapleyy (talk) 02:25, 4 March 2015 (CET)

Well, I've seen it now. Page deleted, thanks. ~ Meneth (talk) 09:22, 4 March 2015 (CET)

Update to version 1.10

It is easy to change the version without check if it is really updated!! I already find some of this error!! For example: [1]. But in in 1.9 Arabia can no longer form Egypt, so it is NOT "still the same in 1.10". Stigni (talk) 11:09, 5 March 2015 (CET)

The same in Bukhara or update Land Warfare and there isn't Siege Ability (it is introduced in 1.6 patch). I don't want to know how he get 200 ticket. Stigni (talk) 11:42, 5 March 2015 (CET)
Fine, I'll take a look through the country articles to verify the ideas and decisions again. Mapleyy (talk) 13:49, 5 March 2015 (CET)
He got a lot of tickets by doing a lot of good work. That a small minority of that wasn't quite up to par isn't a significant issue.
Of course, he won't be getting any tickets for simply correcting his own mistakes, but making some mistakes is human. As far as I can tell, the vast majority of his updates are correct.
I'll give you a couple of tickets for pointing out those mistakes when I next process edits though. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:43, 5 March 2015 (CET)
FYI, I've went through all the country pages and made 13 corrections. Mapleyy (talk) 16:10, 5 March 2015 (CET)
That's great. I probably won't process your edits until tomorrow. Rather tired right now. ~ Meneth (talk) 20:28, 5 March 2015 (CET)

Question on flags

How close do flags have to be to the in-game ones to be considered acceptable? Just as an example, Armenia's deviates somewhat... just wondering, since some of these (e.g. Aztec) shouldn't be hard to put together if that's the case. Mapleyy (talk) 05:32, 6 March 2015 (CET)

Well, it should at the very least clearly be the same motif. Though I'm not sure I consider that Armenian flag an improvement; if one looks at the thumbnails the old one looks a bit better. So I'm gonna go ahead and revert that one.
So I think a good rule of thumb is that in thumbnail form it has to look at least as good as the old flag. I hope that helps. ~ Meneth (talk) 08:43, 6 March 2015 (CET)
Oh, I was looking at if the country had a page, and if it looked nice on that... Guess I'll keep the thumbnail rule in mind though --TheWinner (talk) 10:11, 6 March 2015 (CET)


Hi, why'd I get deducted tickets for not providing examples of the conditions? That column was just added by Certh while I was editing the page, so I kind of felt I needed to put it in there, (though I don't really think it's needed for most of them). Doesn't mention examples anywhere on the tickets page either. Basically, I would've gotten more tickets for less work if I left the examples column out of my edit, it looks like --TheWinner (talk) 14:47, 6 March 2015 (CET)

My mistake; I thought "example" was included in my description of the task. However, it turns out I also misread it as 2 conditions rather than 4. (It's now reduced to 2 since there's no longer a handy list to refer to)
So your ticket number should be about right anyway. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:09, 6 March 2015 (CET)

Wiki contest question and a suggestion

Sweden national idea name.png

Hi, I am a new editor to this wiki, and just when I had created my first content, I noticed the wiki contest. It seemed like I would sort of automatically get my tickets, but I would just like to let you know that I haven't got them yet - it seems like you have to grant them manually, so of course I understand and respect that you also have other matters to attend to, but I am just letting you know. My contributions can be found at this page.
Futhermore, I have a suggestion. I do not really know where to post it, but I suspect this is a good place as any. I think it would be a good idea to have the name of the nation ideas at each country page - it can sometimes be hard to find out if the nation have unique ideas, or which national idea group they are part of. It seems logical that France has French ideas and Spain has Spanish ideas, but it is not always that easy to check that.
This do of course require some work, I wouldn't matter going through all the nations and fill out the name of the national idea group, but this will require a new cell in the country-table template. I do not know how to do that (or even if I have permission to do it), so I would like to hear if you could do it, if you approve my suggestion. --Chrras (talk) 23:26, 7 March 2015 (CET)

My apologies for being slow to give out tickets the last few days. I've come down with a cold, so I haven't had the energy to go through edits.
I'll process all unprocessed edits once I'm feeling better.
It'd be doable to make the "name" parameter of the template override it being named "ideas and traditions" if set, which could then be used for any nation without completely unique ideas. I'll try to remember to think about whether that'd be a good idea. ~ Meneth (talk) 00:26, 8 March 2015 (CET)
You do not have to apology, it is totally understandable.
Regarding the national ideas and traditions I am glad that you'll consider it. I think it would be a good idea. Currently, you have to browse the National ideas page whenever you need the information, and that page is extremely long and it can be quite hard to find the information that you're actually looking for. If you want to find out which national idea group a specific country has, you'll have to look in the list, and some of them is depending on culture, other on locations or tech-group. I was thinking just to add another cell in the table under the flag, as shown in the picture to the right. Another idea could be to make the header, currently saying "Ideas and traditions", say for instance "Swedish ideas and traditions" or "Andean ideas and traditions" --Chrras (talk) 01:12, 8 March 2015 (CET)
Group and unique idea boxes differ in the fact, that the boxes of group ideas begin with a note about the requirements of the group. For unique ideas - I don’t see a problem, but to display the name of group ideas should be self-evident. (I prefer your thoughts Meneth instead of expanding the {{Country}} template.) – Lillebror (talk) 09:54, 8 March 2015 (CET)
I know this isn't a huge change at all, just a little flavour making it more clear if this country has unique national ideas, group national ideas (and which group) etc. I know you can look it up in the National ideas page, and if the country is part of a nation idea group, it is most likely also stated in the box at the country-page.
With the expanded country-template, if you just are looking through the country-pages for a country to play, which I know at least some people do, the information would already be there and furthermore clearer and easier to understand. But yeah, I understand your thoughts, and maybe this wasn't as good a suggestion as it sounded in my head --Chrras (talk) 10:56, 8 March 2015 (CET)
Your idea is good. It is an improvement.
A name alone says nothing. France has French ideas, Spain has Spanish ideas and Ceylon has Ceylonese ideas - no, Ceylon’s unique ideas are called “Sinhalese Ideas”. Italy uses Italian ideas - true, but which of the two?
As on country pages the idea group template is set just below the country template I do not really know what speaks against the naming to write in there. – Lillebror (talk) 13:56, 8 March 2015 (CET)
I made changes on the {{Idea group}} template as it was my thoughts. For the result see as example: Mainz. – Lillebror (talk) 11:35, 9 March 2015 (CET)
That looks good, thanks. It is going to take some work to get it to all country pages, but I am of course willing to help ;) --Chrras (talk) 12:23, 9 March 2015 (CET)
No. I have changed the {{Idea group}} template, so that the change is on all pages off countries with group national ideas. It was not my intention to change the pages of countries with unique ideas - for a better differentiation of these two country groups (with or without unique national ideas), which you've demanded. – Lillebror (talk) 12:52, 9 March 2015 (CET)
(If you want the ideas name in the infobox header for all countries, we have do edit all pages of countries with unique ideas. Then I would however suggest that one add a line "National ideas" to the country template, but which do not contain the name of the ideas but rather the values ‘unique’, ‘group’ or ‘generic’.) – Lillebror (talk) 13:31, 9 March 2015 (CET)

(Unindent) Looks good. I agree with Lillebror that there isn't much point to specifically marking unique ideas as unique. Simply marking non-unique ideas should be good enough. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:38, 9 March 2015 (CET)

I think I misunderstood you Lillebror. Are all the non-unique ideas automatically marked now, or do we still have to fill out the name in the templates?
Non-unique ideas are automatically marked now. – Lillebror (talk) 17:47, 9 March 2015 (CET)
Great! :) --Chrras (talk) 20:27, 9 March 2015 (CET)


Can I have some tickets for that new topic?

Sign your talk-page comments with four tildes (~~~~).
I'm processing edits right now. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:40, 11 March 2015 (CET)

Contest HoI3

Hi Meneth. I was one of the winners of HoI3 in the contest, and I just set up my email so you could please send me the cd key. Sorry for being a few days late. Thanks. --Curbon7 (talk) 11:49, 18 March 2015 (CET)

Will send it to you this afternoon. ~ Meneth (talk) 12:42, 18 March 2015 (CET)

Random Page Bug

Hi Meneth. The random page link on the sidebar takes you only to Genoa. It's been like that for about a week. --Curbon7 (talk) 02:01, 22 March 2015 (CET)

Thanks for alerting me of this. Turns out the new search engine (installed 3 days ago) also overrode how Special:Random works, and somehow broke it. I've turned off it affecting Special:Random, so it now works once more. ~ Meneth (talk) 02:13, 22 March 2015 (CET)

Icon template

I have implemented your suggestion on my talk page to split the {{icon}} template based on the first letter of the identifier in my sandbox. Please take a look at, Meneth. For testing I have copied the technology page provided with the split template to my sandbox. – Lillebror (talk) 13:06, 29 March 2015 (CEST)

Seems to have reduced rendering times to a third (from ~15s to ~5.25s). Great work.
I'm not quite understanding what you're doing here: "{{User:Lillebror/sandbox/icon/a|{{lc:{{{1}}}}}|w{{#if:{{{2|}}}||NULL}}={{{2}}}}}". ~ Meneth (talk) 13:10, 29 March 2015 (CEST)
Oh. I think you are asking for the w parameter.
The call of the template should not be changed. I simply want to pass the optional second parameter to the subtemplate. But "{{User:Lillebror/sandbox/icon/a|{{lc:{{{1}}}}}|{{{2}}}}}" did not work in all possible cases. I tried several terms till I found this “construction” on a wiki help page. If the second parameter exists and is defined w gets this value assigned. In the other cases the parameter is called wNULL, which has no function in the subtemplate.
Do you or someone else know an easier solution? – Lillebror (talk) 13:57, 29 March 2015 (CEST)
{{#if:{{{2|}}}|w={{{2}}}|}}, perhaps? That way the "w" parameter will only be defined if actually set. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:01, 29 March 2015 (CEST)
Found the page: – Lillebror (talk) 15:54, 29 March 2015 (CEST)

Strategy guide navbox

Do we have any plans for a navbox like the EU3 one? Split into continents and enabling quick links through the wiki to other national guides? Dauth (talk) 21:17, 14 May 2015 (CEST)

No plans, but I'd be happy to hear any ideas you've got for such a setup. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:18, 14 May 2015 (CEST)
Given the huge number of countries we have a few options. Firstly I think it might be worth only placing a country onto the template once the guide is Class A, I'd like your thoughts on this.
Option 1) Like the EU3 one, all countries in a table, however this can become over large especially with the ideas on the right panel too
Option 2) EU3 style but in continental blocks with links to the other continents available, see below for general idea
Western Europe

Western Europe: Austria • France • Navarra • etc

Continents: Eastern Europe  • Asia  • Africa  • etc

Eastern Europe would link to the Eastern Europe navbox or section on Countries so people can get to other guides easily. To improve accessibility I think you should be able to get anywhere in the wiki using just the mouse. Dauth (talk) 21:31, 14 May 2015 (CEST)
The first idea is definitely a no-go; too many countries for that.
The second idea could probably work though. Not sure there'd be much point to linking the other continents though; might as well just link the countries page, no? ~ Meneth (talk) 23:17, 14 May 2015 (CEST)
Linking to continents goes back to my point about being able to get anywhere using just the mouse. It will be one or two lines for each template, not a huge amount in the scale of the number of countries in Western Europe. I'll try to put something together later today. You never answered on requiring high quality guides before putting them in the template. Dauth (talk) 09:11, 15 May 2015 (CEST)
As countries should have a unique strategy, I see not necessarily the need of a navigation box. But if …
At the moment we have 80 countries with strategy pages. I would prefer a navbox with collapsible content like at wikipedia (perhaps multiple times), example Felinae. With a division by continents and culture groups.
Secondly, I would like to have a style that corresponds to the Infoboxes. Perhaps approximately so:
– Lillebror (talk) 09:58, 15 May 2015 (CEST)
I think that'd be overstyled. Better to keep things simple:
~ Meneth (talk) 11:45, 15 May 2015 (CEST)
I'm with Meneth, less is more in this case, this will be a big box even if closed.
I think there is something to be said for pre-collapsed boxes but I'm not sure I'm a fan of them. (Q1) Is there a way to have some boxes open on certain pages? For the France guide I'd want the Western Europe sub-box open with the Eastern Eur and Asia sub-boxes closed but for Ming Asia would be open and both European ones closed?
(Q2) Should we have a minimum content limit before pages are put into the boxes? I know when I was reading the EU3 wiki, finding small strategy guides was always an irritant. Dauth (talk) 12:31, 15 May 2015 (CEST)
A1: It'd have to be a parameter for the template (though technically it could also be hardcoded into the template, but parameter makes more sense). E.G., {{country guides|Western Europe}}.
A2: I think if we are to do this, we should only include pages that have been rated B or higher, yeah. (B isn't especially hard to reach, but does exclude tiny guides) ~ Meneth (talk) 12:34, 15 May 2015 (CEST)


Hello, I believe I have done enough editing to deserve a ticket. I especially edited the pages for the Commonwealth, Vassals and Steppe Hordes. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FrenchOdyssey (Talk) 19:21, 9 June 2015‎

I'll look through your edits later. ~ Meneth (talk) 19:22, 9 June 2015 (CEST)


Sorry if I disturb but I was blocked because of "vandalism". If you will see my edit history you can say that wasn't vandalism and that was edits to contest. I ask for unblock and return my tickets, also sorry for my english, but this isn't my native language Adusak90 (talk) 20:57, 9 June 2015 (CEST)

Don't worry; it was a false positive caused by a bug in that particular filter. That bug has now been fixed.
I'm sorry for the inconvenience caused. Your tickets are of course unaffected by this since it was not your fault that the filter misfired. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:01, 9 June 2015 (CEST)

Icon templates

Maybe that's stupid question but where can be code for commonly used on wiki EU4 icons and text elements found? :p — Preceding unsigned comment added by Krajzen (Talk) 21:33, 9 June 2015

You can see the list at Template:Icon. For example, {{icon|protestant}} will produce this: Protestantism. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:34, 9 June 2015 (CEST)

adding new religions: Theravada, Vajrayana and Mayhayana

I added the new religions Theravada, Vajrayana and Mayhayana to the Religions and denominations page, I couldn't find the heresies for them nor the icons so I used the regular Buddhist icon for a substitute. I'm also pretty new to this and I hope I didn't screw anything up! thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Psychoguineapig (Talk) 04:08, 10 June 2015 (CEST)

Added the icons for Theravada, Vajrayana and Mayhayana to the template. – Lillebror (talk) 07:50, 10 June 2015 (CEST)

Grammar and other semi-major edits for Ming's page

Hi, I made quite a few edits to the Ming page, and many of them were grammatical errors which made it hard to understand what was being said. I think I should get more than one ticket for this.

On a side note, I tried adding the government ranks to the page right under the line with "Celestial Empire." It appears in the editor, but when I submit the edits it doesn't appear. How should I implement government ranks? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zenphoenix (Talk) 05:50, 10 June 2015 (CEST)

You're quite right. Does 3 sound more reasonable?
Rank is not currently part of the country template. Not sure if it really needs to be. ~ Meneth (talk) 08:44, 10 June 2015 (CEST)

Edits on User pages

I know its generally frowned on but we do have several Userpages and Userpage/testpages which are contributing to missing images and appearing in categories where they really do belong. I think we should just nowiki their pages if they're not currently under development. Do you agree? This will then help me work more on tidying up the remaining pages which require attention. Dauth (talk) 22:56, 10 June 2015 (CEST)

Sounds fine to me.
"No edits in the last 30 days" should be a decent definition for "not currently under development" I think. ~ Meneth (talk) 23:04, 10 June 2015 (CEST)
Thanks, and sound advice about the 30 day limit. Dauth (talk) 23:08, 10 June 2015 (CEST)

Development cost

{{{name2}}} ideas

Traditions.png Traditions:

+50% Naval force limit modifier
-10% Shipbuilding time

Inflation reduction.png Found the Amsterdam Wisselbank

+0.10 Yearly inflation reduction

Merchants.png Dutch Trading Spirit

+1 Merchants
+10% Trade Range

Development cost.png Polders

−10% Development cost

Naval leader fire.png Instructie voor de Admiraliteiten

+2 Naval leader fire

Tolerance heretic.png Embrace Humanism

+3 Tolerance of heretics

Siege ability.png Army Sappers

+10% Siege ability

Infantry combat ability.png Platoon Fire

+10% Infantry combat ability

Idea bonus.png Ambition:

+15% National trade income modifier

Increasing the development of a province is a paid feature of Common Sense.pngCommon Sense. Therefore also the global/local cost modifier. There are many ideas that reduce these costs, i.e. Holland - idea 3 Polders - -10% Development cost. If you haven't (enabeled) Common Sense: Hollands idea 3 Polders is +10% Goods produced modifier (global_trade_goods_size_modifier). Also the icon chances.

How can we handle this behavior?

Also local. University gives -20% local development cost with Common Sense and +2Gold Icon.png tax income without Common Sence. – Lillebror (talk) 11:23, 11 June 2015 (CEST)

I'm not entirely sure. We might have to note it on the relevant pages as it happens. ~ Meneth (talk) 11:51, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
Could we do it like the national ideas on the EU3 wiki where the older versions were shown in brackets next to the icons for the relevant expansion? Dauth (talk) 11:56, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
Could you give an example of that? ~ Meneth (talk) 14:59, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
Linky here. Have a look at the primary effects since section in the table. Dauth (talk) 15:13, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
Takes quite a lot of space though. Might be the best solution regardless, but I'm not sure. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:15, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
My first thought was to add a simply a reference. What do you think about the solution on the right side? (idea stolen from here:; perhaps also her: )
But I now have a more urgent question (I'm updateing the bonus table template.): What is the default? With or without Common Sense? – Lillebror (talk) 15:55, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
That hover solution looks pretty good.
With all DLC is always considered the default on the wikis. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:57, 11 June 2015 (CEST)
Implemented the templates: {{Hover box}} and “Development cost” (Replaced by {{DLC-only}} - 15 September 2015‎). See the infobox on the right for the result.
It is possible to shrink the grey background of the templates {{green}} and {{red}} that one can see the complete dotted line (“padding: 0px 2px;” instead of “padding: 1px 3px;”). – Lillebror (talk) 17:36, 17 June 2015 (CEST)

(Unindenting) Done. ~ Meneth (talk) 12:03, 18 June 2015 (CEST)

Users removing templates

Normally I don't have a problem with this, especially if the user has taken the time to correct what the template was there for. However I've seen a few cases now where a template has been removed but probably shouldn't have been. In these cases I've highlighted the copy edit which needs to happen but should I just put the template back in along with explanation of why? On a side note is there a less public way of communicating that I can use if needed? Dauth (talk) 00:13, 17 June 2015 (CEST)

If a template has been remove when it shouldn't, feel free to re-add it with a note in the edit summary.
You can contact me on IRC (linked on my user page) or via email (in the sidebar while on my user page or talk page) if you need somewhere more private. ~ Meneth (talk) 00:17, 17 June 2015 (CEST)

Updating a 1.1 section

How many tickets do I get for updating the 1.1 section on the Korea page to 1.12 and 1.10+? I also edited the rest of the page somewhat significantly if that helps.

Edit: I also made quite a few grammatical and spelling corrections for a number of pages, and it should be enough for at least a couple tickets. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zenphoenix (Talk) 02:08, 19 June 2015‎

I'll figure that out when I hand out the next batch of tickets today. ~ Meneth (talk) 10:57, 19 June 2015 (CEST)

How do I use the "keys" i got to unlock my prizes?

Hi Meneth,

I won a ck2/hoi3 pair from the wiki contest. When I found your email, all I got was the "key" for both games, I'm wondering how I'm supposed to use it to claim my prize.

Thanks before hand! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknownuser123 (Talk) 15:45, 21 June 2015‎ (CEST)

You can activate those on Steam. My apologies for not mentioning that in the email. ~ Meneth (talk) 16:22, 21 June 2015 (CEST)

Tuscan strategy

Why do you remove strategy section from Tuscany page? We could add a Formation strategy for Lucca/Siena. Stigni (talk) 19:10, 1 July 2015 (CEST)

It doesn't specifically need one. Though it could refer to the strategy sections of other relevant countries. Great Britain#Strategy is an example of this. ~ Meneth (talk) 19:13, 1 July 2015 (CEST)
Yes, but look at Italy#Strategy or Germany#Strategy; do we need to change Italy/Germany? Stigni (talk) 20:10, 1 July 2015 (CEST)
They don't need to be changed. But Tuscany doesn't specifically need a strategy. It's not a significant lack. ~ Meneth (talk) 20:13, 1 July 2015 (CEST)
OK. Without strategy and with Lucca/Siena not relevant we can merge Florence/Tuscany pages. Stigni (talk) 20:25, 1 July 2015 (CEST)
Not sure about that since other countries than Florence can form Tuscany. ~ Meneth (talk) 20:27, 1 July 2015 (CEST)

Wanted pages list

Is there any way to have the Special:WantedPages in alphabetical order, while still keeping more linked to pages at the top, so alphabetical by links if that makes sense? It would make hunting down common mistakes easier. Dauth (talk) 11:35, 4 July 2015 (CEST)

Not to the best of my knowledge. ~ Meneth (talk) 12:13, 4 July 2015 (CEST)

Template/Blueprint for creating/extending country pages for adhering to a best-practices format

Hi Meneth, is there a general template for standardizing how a country page should look like? Something like

- countrybox - ideabox - introductory paragraph - missions [optional] - decisions [optional] - strategy - navbox

In particular, other information that specifies how certain of these subsections should look like, so all country pages have the same structure? - This relates to, for example, the strategy section, which could have a "subtemplate" ...

This could be so a user can create a page from scratch or copy the relevant subsection template and fill in the information/remove lorem ipsums ... Currently, I can't find any resource that assists a wiki contributor in this task, and in particular strategy sections are very different stylistically between different country pages ... --Lateralus (talk) 14:21, 7 July 2015 (CEST)

Yep, that breakdown is correct other than missing "events" (goes above missions) and "formation requirements" (goes above decisions).
There's no real standard for strategy, as the only important thing there really is communicating a coherent strategy, which can be done in tons of ways. Don't want to constrain the editor too much there.
I could probably set up a page detailing that, though I'm not sure where it'd make sense to put it or link it. Not entirely sure whether it is truly needed either; most new country pages are created by experienced editors. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:29, 7 July 2015 (CEST)
Please is big bold letters tell people to stop using you/your too, put it as a hidden section on the layout that they copy and open to edit if possible Dauth (talk) 21:39, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
I don't understand what you're saying. Could you rephrase? ~ Meneth (talk) 21:42, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
One of the major issues with our strategy pages is that people use you/your which is not part of the style. If we're inventing a structure to use; can we somehow in the structure add a note using the below code

<!-- Please refrain from using you/your as it against the wiki style guides -->

We have ~20 pages which need rewrites and I'd like to get ahead of it for a change. Dauth (talk) 21:46, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
Oh right, in the template itself?
Anyway, I guess the most reasonable place to stick the template would be as a sub-page of the style guidelines. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:53, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
There's now a template at Project:Style/Country. Feel free to make improvements. ~ Meneth (talk) 22:27, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
Now, if I may interject, is it wise to apply the same style demands to strategy guides as to the rest of the wiki? It is one thing to describe things (it is such and such...) and quite another to give a guidance (do that, don't do that...). The latter comes more naturally with second-person references, doesn't it? --E boyd (talk) 20:14, 9 July 2015 (CEST)

Second screen

With the achievements pages I was wondering how many people use the wiki on a second screen, perhaps checking what event chains may mean or some new events/decisions. Do you know? And if so is it worth installing a dedicated mobile skin like EUIV wikipedia article (mobile version) ? Dauth (talk) 21:39, 8 July 2015 (CEST)

Google Analytics only gives the resolution of the monitor the browser is on, not all browsers, so no way to know how many people use multiple monitors. Steam doesn't seem to track this either; despite providing a breakdown of multimonitor resolutions there doesn't seem to be a stat on how many actually have more than one monitor (the multi-monitor breakdown adds up to 100%).
Mobile is a big chunk of our traffic though (just short of 1 in every 4 visit, though they visit somewhat fewer pages per visit). A mobile-specific layout might be added at some point, but currently another project takes precedence. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:52, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
I meant more people using phones/tablets. Are the other projects the work we're doing or do you want help with something else? Dauth (talk) 23:56, 8 July 2015 (CEST)
Working on an unannounced project. Not something wiki users could help with, no. Will tell you if there's anything you can help with later. ~ Meneth (talk) 00:05, 9 July 2015 (CEST)

Are bonus table templates updated automatically?

That is, if I'm updating a section and it contains a bonus table can I safely assume that it is updated to the latest patch and thus mark the whole section as updated? --E boyd (talk) 19:58, 9 July 2015 (CEST)

They're updated manually, but you shouldn't concern yourself with it. So mark the section as up to date, yeah. ~ Meneth (talk) 20:43, 9 July 2015 (CEST)

Extensions requests

If you've seen the discussion on the events page you'll see I've been talking about an extension which apparently allows transclusion of sections rather than full pages Mediawiki page. I also asked some time ago about the mobile extension, I know you said a possible in the future but at we have 25% of views from mobile its probably worth doing mobile frontend I think this is the link. If you want me to do testing in a hidden wiki just email me to have a look. Dauth (talk) 20:28, 14 July 2015 (CEST)

I've installed the transclusion extension now, with both section and header based transclusion. Seems to work fine.
Mobile Frontend (I'm aware of it already; tried it out a year or so ago with not much success) isn't nearly as plug and play, so will have to wait. ~ Meneth (talk) 20:44, 14 July 2015 (CEST)
Seems Mobile Frontend now has actual detection. Didn't (at least not detection that worked remotely well) when I last tried it. That helps.
However, until the wikis have been upgraded to 1.25 it depends on another extension. So won't be installing it at this time, but I'll put it on my list of things to consider. ~ Meneth (talk) 20:46, 14 July 2015 (CEST)
Not sure they're behaving or I have the syntax right. How would we get the formation section from the spain page Spain#Formation ? Dauth (talk) 20:58, 14 July 2015 (CEST)
Label the section with: <section begin=chapter1 />this is a chapter<section end=chapter1 />. To insert: {{#lst:articleX|chapter1}}. For further informations see: Extension:Labeled Section Transclusion – Lillebror (talk) 21:19, 14 July 2015 (CEST)
You can also transclude entire sections (as labelled by regular wiki headers) like this: {{lsth:Spain|Formation}}. Usually that should be what you want, and it avoids confusing section stuff being littered around pages. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:23, 14 July 2015 (CEST)
But this does not work if the heading is in one of our infoboxes. – Lillebror (talk) 21:28, 14 July 2015 (CEST)
True enough. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:59, 14 July 2015 (CEST)

Country style guide

I'm planning on doing a bit of work, principally on the country strategy pages (if you are familiar with my past work I administered the Paradoxian wikis for several years, and wrote a majority of content for those wikis, the style guides, created the version system, etc). In any event, I'm wondering if anyone has created a country style guide? I don't see one, and many country guides are hit and miss. I'm starting to create one already, but figured I'd ask just in case. --Musides (talk) 16:42, 21 July 2015 (CEST)

There's one at Project:Style/Country. Feel free to improve upon it. ~ Meneth (talk) 16:56, 21 July 2015 (CEST)

Vanilla vs Expansion packs features

I stumble upon many features described in the wiki that I find (much to my annoyance :) not available in vanilla version. I think it should be a good style to mark them as such. As an owner of vanilla version though I can only verify that a certain feature is not available in vanilla but I cannot say which expansion pack it is part of. Is there an elegant way to deal with it? Shall I put something like 'not available in vanilla' so that other editors with access to expansions can change it later to 'available in ... expansion pack'?--E boyd (talk) 13:00, 29 July 2015 (CEST)

It may be worth creating some amboxes to say. This section requires DLC XXX, however the wiki standard is to assume up to date and with all DLCs. Dauth (talk) 13:39, 29 July 2015 (CEST)
I think at least some notification is desirable. Personally I caught myself several times already in situations where I was blaming the wiki or the game thinking the article was not-up-to-date or the game buggy only to find out that certain features work differently in expansions. Also some features are ascribed to patches but in fact they are parts of expansions which go together with patches. For owners of all expansions this is purely academic but it is an important distinction for other players which at least worth mentioning, I believe. --E boyd (talk) 14:31, 29 July 2015 (CEST)
In the case of development cost bonuses, we added template:development cost to handle the DLC disparity.
It uses a template:hover box to add a note about how it works without DLC. That could be used for other sentences that doesn't apply if you don't have the DLC. For whole sections, the ambox idea Dauth mentions seems good. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:44, 29 July 2015 (CEST)
I think it would usually concern sections of articles. Therefore I propose a compact form as {{SVersion}}.

– Lillebror (talk) 15:12, 29 July 2015 (CEST)

I've made a minor change to the text but agree with the general idea. Dauth (talk) 15:22, 29 July 2015 (CEST)
Looks quite good. ~ Meneth (talk) 12:49, 30 July 2015 (CEST)
{{Expansion}} – can be used from now – Lillebror (talk) 13:04, 30 July 2015 (CEST)
Great! We should probably document it in the style guidelines or some such.
Oh and I'd like to note that I'm on vacation right now until the 9th of August, so my responses are likely to be slow at times. ~ Meneth (talk) 13:05, 30 July 2015 (CEST)
Already using it, thanks a lot! --E boyd (talk) 15:46, 30 July 2015 (CEST)

Auto pages

I don't know if its possible, and I'm inclined to think not. Is there a way to use a template to convert the computer generated mission/event/decision text into the format we want? If not do you have any ideas for a script to do it? My skills are not really in scripting languages, more for brute number analysis. Dauth (talk) 18:19, 2 August 2015 (CEST)

It's certainly theoretically doable to edit my parser to output with template formatting. No clue how long it'd take though, and I'm currently on vacation so I can't really look into it at the moment. ~ Meneth (talk) 19:11, 2 August 2015 (CEST)


Having spent a while trudging through some absurdly insane filenames I suggest that we should move all user uploaded avatar files to a set prefix. Something like User_avatar_$USERNAME$.ext New users would be asked to follow the rules and we can make the other changes ourselves. Dauth (talk) 09:42, 4 August 2015 (CEST)

"Avatar" as a prefix definitely makes sense, so I support that idea. Not sure sticking their actual username in there makes much sense though; many users on the forums use the same avatar. ~ Meneth (talk) 10:38, 4 August 2015 (CEST)
Lillebror any further thoughts? I saw you deleted the file from the EU4 wiki and pulled from central instead. I'm happy with Avatar as a suggested prefix. Dauth (talk) 11:22, 4 August 2015 (CEST)
The user avatars have their own category. Isn't that sufficient? Okay, you cannot identify them out of a list of filenames, but is this necessary? Renaming 8 files isn't a big deal. If you do, I ask you to write a corresponding note to {{Community Figure}} and {{UserInfo}}. – Lillebror (talk) 08:07, 5 August 2015 (CEST)
It teaches good practice for making sure future filenames make sense. I don't think we're going to get many files added but having a system in place now also for future wikis, EU5? Project Augustus? Adding the note is a good idea thanks. Dauth (talk) 09:44, 5 August 2015 (CEST)

Achievements navboxes

Unindent. Looks like Lillebror and I did it at the same time with a slightly different name. Dauth (talk) 19:46, 20 August 2015 (CEST)

Yes; I sent you a message on Hangouts.
Since Lillebror's is done, and looks good, that's the one that'll be used. ~ Meneth (talk) 19:47, 20 August 2015 (CEST)
Deleted the duplicate. Dauth (talk) 19:50, 20 August 2015 (CEST)

AWB login

How to login with AWB? – Lillebror (talk) 09:17, 15 September 2015 (CEST)

Seems that's broken right now. I'll have to look into it. Breaking AWB was not intended. ~ Meneth (talk) 09:36, 15 September 2015 (CEST)
I have now fixed the problem; this edit was made via AWB. ~ Meneth (talk) 16:19, 15 September 2015 (CEST)
So now you should be able to log in via AWB using your old password. The problem was simply that on user login the wiki tries to make sure your wiki account is tied to a Paradox Account, but since the API bypasses the actual authentication it crashed when trying to fetch your PDX ID. Now the API simply skips that step as well. ~ Meneth (talk) 16:23, 15 September 2015 (CEST)
Great. Many thanks. – Lillebror (talk) 16:44, 15 September 2015 (CEST)

Template:Green produces ill-formed XHTML

{{green|foo}} produces wiki text that looks something like <span class="effect-green">'''foo</span>'''. The second set of three apostrophes is outside the span, while the first set is inside. It translates into XHTML as <span class="effect-green"><b>foo</span></b>. The close tags are in the wrong order, which is not well-formed and causes the page to fail validation. (Arguably the fact that this is possible is a bug in MediaWiki, though. There's also four other validation errors outside the wiki text: unescaped &s in URLs and an img element with no alt attribute.) Hairy Dude (talk) 01:55, 2 October 2015 (CEST)

Just checked Template:Red - it has the same issue. Hairy Dude (talk) 02:00, 2 October 2015 (CEST)
Thanks. I've corrected that misplaced span on this wiki now. It'll still be incorrect on other wikis; I might fix it there too at some point. ~ Meneth (talk) 11:55, 2 October 2015 (CEST)

IP is vandalising

How do I ban/block him? Help!--Henryii2 (talk) 21:32, 30 November 2015 (CET)

EDIT: WTF? He's vandalizing my talk page!--Henryii2 (talk) 21:32, 30 November 2015 (CET)

EDIT: I see you've banned him. He seems to be switching IPs though.--Henryii2 (talk) 21:32, 30 November 2015 (CET)

Please don't forget to sign your talk page edits. Use four tildes (~~~~).

~ Meneth (talk) 21:31, 30 November 2015 (CET)

Ah, ok. I signed my older ones.--Henryii2 (talk) 21:32, 30 November 2015 (CET)

A bot to automatically place the unsigned template?

Just thinking about it. I could probably code one sooner or later. Maybe the wiki could have a bot that will automatically place the unsigned template?--Henryii2 (talk) 21:44, 30 November 2015 (CET)

The main issue is that someone would need to actually write it. ~ Meneth (talk) 21:45, 30 November 2015 (CET)
I know a good amount of Python. Not all EU4 players know EU4script exclusively (the name I made up for the EU4 player-accessible code). Also see PyWikiBot. It would be easy to implement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Henryii2 (Talk) 23:35, 30 November 2015 (CET)

Will the people who added things today earn tickets?

I mean the people who edited today, before the contest to start. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 123e55 (Talk) 14:44, 1 December 2015 (CET)

Edits based on the patch notes will probably be counted, yes. Edits unrelated to those, no. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:48, 1 December 2015 (CET)
So will I gain some tickets on the work on cheat commands? ~ 123e55 (talk) 14:48, 1 December 2015 (CET)
Will need to discuss with another person whether to give tickets for patch note related edits before release first. If we decide to do so, those edits of yours will count yes. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:52, 1 December 2015 (CET)
Ok,thanks for taking this in consideration! :)~ 123e55 (talk) 14:53, 1 December 2015 (CET)

Map Images Permission Error

Hello, last time I was able to upload the updated religion map to the wiki without any trouble, but this time when I access the Special:Upload page to do so I get a permission error saying that it's only authorized for Autoconfirmed users or administrators. What would I need to do to upload updated map images? --Zraith (talk) 13:47, 2 December 2015 (CET)

I've given you the necessary permissions now. ~ Meneth (talk) 13:48, 2 December 2015 (CET)
Thank you. --Zraith (talk) 13:51, 2 December 2015 (CET)
Why was this happened, Meneth? The userlist has Zraith and Zraith&. Why are these accounts not merged? I think Erthzeid has the same problem, see Talk:Colonial_nation#How_to_Edith_Colonial_Idea. – Lillebror (talk) 15:09, 2 December 2015 (CET)
Because those users didn't merge during the account setup process. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:11, 2 December 2015 (CET)
I've reassigned the edits of Zraith, Erthzeid, and Stigni to their new accounts now. Only on the EU4 Wiki mind; didn't check if they'd been active elsewhere. But the number of revisions reassigned roughly matched their edit count for all three, so probably not.
If you see anyone else with the issue, just poke me and I'll reassign their edits. ~ Meneth (talk) 12:32, 3 December 2015 (CET)


Have you considered installing Scribunto? It would probably solve performance issues with heavily used templates like {{icon}} and {{flag}} and let the latter work with tags without breaking the server. Hairy Dude (talk) 14:21, 8 December 2015 (CET)

Due to caching, the only significant performance issue with templates is the time it can take to preview pages. For the icon template this was solved by splitting it based on the first letter.
I'm not aware of any such issue with the flag template seeing as it uses no fancy parsing whatsoever. ~ Meneth (talk) 14:23, 8 December 2015 (CET)

Special Mission

I made a wrong summary for Special Mission. It is updated from 1.12 (not 1.10) I made a wrong copy/paste from Trade mission summary. Stigni (talk) 15:37, 8 December 2015 (CET)

No worries. I base the ticket numbers on the edits themselves anyway, the summary just makes it easier to understand the intention. ~ Meneth (talk) 15:39, 8 December 2015 (CET)

Could I?

Could I get some more points for my contribution? ( +0,5 tickets would be ok )

Meneth is currently busy in the real world and I'm handing out tickets. I can discuss with him when he's free but that's well after the end of the contest. Easiest way to get more tickets will be to update a couple of things. Dauth (talk) 11:32, 12 December 2015 (CET)